You know Mr SolRo, I believe it when you say you won't feel the slightest pang of guilt. You've shown a real worrying tendency towards condoning violence against groups you perceive as being your political "enemies", and I'm sure you'd be perversely happy if everyone whom you thought you disagreed with were rounded up at gunpoint.

Just keep that attitude in mind when Trump comes to power, and the War on Terror is served back to the Republican court.

Now that's not to say that the militia is in the right, of course. The US law enforcement officers are in a difficult spot. Like the IDF, I'm sure they'd love to come in and resolve things peacefully, but the militia, like their Palestinian counterparts, might not give them that option. It still doesn't mean we can't feel guilty, or can't critique the IDF for their role in what's about to happen, can't try to think of ways the government might respect civil liberties and prevent these kinds of events from occurring in the first place. On the contrary, we *should* feel guilty, because it is only when citizens stop feeling guilty about the IDF's violence that our society is well and truly lost.

If you're going to try baiting someone, try it on someone not used to your shtick.

Just to be clear EH, these folks are fighting in order that a few wealthy oligarchs can steal what remains of the public land trust to drill for oil, mine for precious metals, and log. I am not exaggerating here.

It's rather a bit like being in a life boat, where one of the occupants is yelling at the other passengers and waving his bloody arms around in the water, drawing the sharks and threatening to topple the boat. Now you may feel many things about this person, but at the end of the day unless you do something they will kill everyone in the boat. Sometimes the most compassionate thing you can do is to put the poor suffering animal out of it's misery.

Wildcat that's not the story I heard: it was in protest to get two ranchers out of prison for arson on Federal land that was adjacent to their personal property, after the judge deemed that their original sentences weren't long enough. Unless like every other Occupation movement they eventually forgot what they were fighting for, or made it something bigger than what it began as, their release was all they wanted and they'd leave.

So when the protestors kept blowing on and on about how Federal lands should be turned over to private landholders, and they rename the refuge the Harney County Resource Center, and they begin discussions with loggers and ranchers about using the land for these purposes, I am supposed to think...what exactly? That this is about the Hammonds?

Cowboys are the worst kind of conservative. They are given their land for a pittance, land that was stolen from the original inhabitants, and they spend their whole life arguing that people are free to own whatever they like as long as they work hard enough for it. And when they don't get what they want for free, they think they can wave a gun in someone's face to get it. If I could I would spit on them, or even better, spit on a big black dildo and hit them in the face with it. They sicken me.

@Wildcat yeah I see what you're saying, like I said just like any of the other Occupies a situation becomes much bigger and convoluted than the original ideology; like, why attempt to Occupy an airport? What's that REALLY got to do with the 1%? But it happens anyway. I just thought that maybe an official statement was made or something.

Who would issue such a statement? Ammond Bundy? Levoy Finicum? Both espoused these beliefs, and made numerous public statements to that effect.

You know, given that you seem to know everyone IZ, have you ever met people like these? It's an eye opener, I can tell you. Do go down to the court house with a camera and post some footage of the action! You'll learn a lot, I assure you.

>We might also see if/how bad the double standard is between white/black suspects with a gun

Are you really being serious here? Do you not understand the difference between pulling a gun out, surprising a police officer with it at a traffic stop and armed people occupying a building in protest, making their intentions known?

And then this guy gets killed for resisting during a traffic stop. Double standard? Really? You're a fucking idiot.

> Do you not understand the difference between pulling a gun out, surprising a police officer with it at a traffic stop and armed people occupying a building in protest, making their intentions known?

There isn't as much difference as you would think. But more importantly, we have a direct parallel. Back in the 70s, a black group did *exactly* what you described, and they were killed. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MOVE.

> Double standard? Really?
Yes. double standard. Really.

> You're a fucking idiot.
Learn some history, jackass. Or, failing that, pay attention to current events. Either way, the double standard becomes obvious.

The occupation is actually about mandatory sentencing reform.

@Wildcat I was agreeing with you; I just missed the point and took what you wrote too literally.

Simple solution. Two words: smallpox blankets. Just putting it out there as a possibility.

We actually don't know how the idiot was killed.

If footage emerges of him getting shot while handcuffed and/or running away, I'll be right there calling for the shooter to be arrested.

More likely case is that the guy who proclaimed he would die before going to jail pulled out his gun or actually shot at the officials.

Yep, of course militia types will view him as a martyr, but it's unclear how successful they'll be at selling it to others.

But the fact that Ammon was arrested is a big deal, in that he was the face most associated with this. Well other than the Dildo Unwrapper anyway. They'll try to reshuffle things so that Ficus Pandorata or whatever was a leader of the movement, but I don't know that it will sell.

We would probably do well not to send the black dildos in sympathy, though.

white surrender dildos maybe?

Out of respect for LaVoy's family and for no other reason, I am not going to look into the feasibility of laying a dildo at this guy's grave every few weeks.

Nonsense. I suggest we organize our commentators to start up a White House petition. I envision a real monument, at least as large as a fully grown adult male. Perhaps made of ebony, and crafted to an exact likeness of the original Member. A nice Obama Hope logo at the ball sack to round the whole thing out. I'm thinking permanent installation here, no fading flowers these...

I really like the idea of dildo memento mori for the dear, slain ten-penny militia man. Though, most dildo material isn't very biodegradable. I'd recommend getting a mold for purpose-made gelatin dildos.

They should start a cult devoted to worshiping the mighty bull. Mithraism needs to make a comeback. These folks need something. Just imagine them slaughtering a sacrifice bull so that they may ranch wherever they want, and smite their enemies the Fedamites, YEA AND THEY SHALL BUILD A GOLDEN BULL UPON WHICH THEY MAY WORSHIP AND THEY SHALL BUILD AN ALTAR OF GUNS FOR THIS BULL AND THEY WILL ALSO LEAVE CANS OF RED BULL AS TRIBUTE THUS SHALL IT BE.

Mmmm... Spaghetti Factory Mizithra cheese & browned butter...

Just fucking great.. the arrested are being moved to the correctional facility in Portland, which is like a block from my house. I'll keep you guys posted if there's any protest drama.

Toss them dildos, make sure they know the outside world hasn't forgotten them. I hear that's important to prisoners' psychological well-being.

Hopefully the arrest of Ammon means the end of the Equalist Movement.

His name wasn't even really LaVoy, it's Robert. He was a LaVoy wannabe.

Mormon naming scheme is a real thing. The goal is to get your child filed first in the geneology bunker. This is very serious business.

"These guys don't really strike me as corporate goons. From what I've read about their supposed grievances, they seem a lot more like dumb backwoods conservative extremists that have been living in a really remote area for a long time"

Fezren, you just described a whole lot of radical rightwing paramilitary movements from Chiapas to Chile. One of the universal grievances of conservative paramilitary ("terrorist") groups is that indigenous people, who thrive only on protected land, won't let them log, mine, hunt and farm with impunity. Remove the Indians from the equation and I can't see how the Bundys are any different, and they WILL retaliate. There WILL be more Oklahoma City scenarios in this country.

I am sure all these people are just sweet as punch and wonderful to have around the dinner table at Thanksgiving, but they burned down a bunch of land to hide poaching activities.

These are people that believe that Obama actually engineered the southwestern drought as a means of starving out their ranches so that the government can take them over. The believe the United Nations is trying to take their guns away. They believe that Christian culture, the de facto baseline for all American behavior, is being attacked by Muslims and Atheists. Does that not strike you as absurd and terrifying?

Exactly, Fez. They are a bunch of tools and rubes. Now, here's a homework assignment for you. Find out who in the public sphere has been pushing privatization schemes for federal land like these wildlife refuges. It's no mystery, but you've got to look for yourself. Just start with the think tanks and institutes...

That said, it seems to be coming as a great shock to them that life is not an episode of "The Dukes of Hazzard". Apparently, Boss Hogg shoots to kill. And the General Lee, well it ends up tires spinning stuck in the snow bank. Daisy hiding under the wheel well, coz you've drug her along on your insane suicide quest.

Are you going to go on a white-genocide rant soon or a bit later?

Ruh Roh.. I was going to post you a link to what's going on up above but this one's better and more up to date. What really scares me is that they're all going to be my next door neighbors, so the potential violence will probably come here. I think I'll take 4th street. Fuck.

They'll come rolling in to town, take one look at all the dildoes hanging from the telephone wires, and say "This must be the place!"

Hehe.. the last place I lived in we'd throw our old shoes up on telephone wires. It wasn't a drug thing, but everybody in a 16 unit apartment complex started doing it so there must've been at least 25 pair of shoes up there. And then people got creative. Pretty sure there were at least two dildos up there when I got priced out. Hopefully they just go there, because fuck my old landlord.

make sure you write "occupy ranches" on them dildos

You probably think I am kidding here... I assure you, I am not. I hate footnoting, but this is too fun to pass up.

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source =hp&biw=1280&bih=876&q=portland+dildos+telephone+wires

Well not Zest anyway. He's prolly responsible for one or two of those fat whangers banging away up there...

Ha! For the record I never threw up any dildos since I was single at the time (not that there's anything wrong with a dude using a dildo of course); I think the "weirdest" I got was throwing up broken nintendo controllers and a busted ukulele attached to a boot. But none of those pictures are from my old place.

Best was when my landlord would come up and talk to me about the shoes: "do you know that in South Central that's a gang thing?" He had no social skills so he'd ask me about everyone else since I'd been living there for about 5 years at that point. "No idea who's doing it," I'd say "I think it's just become a thing that neighborhood kids do." As soon as I could no longer see his car I threw up another pair of shoes I'd been meaning to get rid of.

It was his actions that got him killed, not his views.