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Comment count is 16
Justin Dohrmann - 2008-08-12

i really can't watch this. sorry. i tried.

kelpfoot - 2008-08-12

Sorry, I submitted the wrong video. The one I meant to submit is a lot lighter on the visual propaganda.

If it helps, much (most?) of the footage in this video is intentionally mislabelled - for instance, they talk about testing with dogs, then show footage of a dog under anesthesia, to create the impression that the dog is undergoing some Shelleyesque procedure.

jaunch - 2008-08-12

While I do think these people are retarded, and don't understand science, I absolutely agree with them when it comes to cosmetics and cleaners. Can't we just assume we shouldn't squirt bleach in our eyes, without needing to test that theory first on an animal?

As for medical research, I say do whatever you want to the animal. It's sad, yes, but I would rather save a loved one's life than an animal's.

dancingshadow - 2008-08-12

Humans are animals. 5 stars for apt description.

dancingshadow - 2008-08-12

oh yeah... I watched 25 seconds... and by 5 I ment 3.

simon666 - 2008-08-12

my aunt is a vet. when he had a conversation in my naive youth about animal testing, she told how most all the treatments for animal diseases were discovered while scientists were researching (testing) on animals for humans.

simon666 - 2008-08-12

he = we, sorry.

Pillager - 2008-08-12

http://www.wired.com/medtech/health/news/2005/07/68260?currentPage =all




Vioxx, Thalidomide, Propulsid, & Baycol all passed with flying colors.

It's time to find a better way.

kelpfoot - 2008-08-12

Vioxx didn't "pass" - Merck deliberately withheld evidence of the risk to get the drug approved.

Thalidomide wasn't tested on pregnant animals before being used on pregnant women. As it turns out, thalidomide is safe for pretty much anyone who isn't a developing fetus, and what we needed was MORE animal testing.

I don't know about your other two examples, but given that your first two were completely fucking wrong, I'll just assume that they're wrong, too.

Pillager - 2008-08-12

Vioxx is a great drug. If you're a monkey with artificially induced heart problems.




"Thalidomide might cause damage to your nerves. It is not known whether this nerve damage is reversible after the drug is stopped. Symptoms of nerve damage include burning, numbness, or tingling of your arms, hands, legs, or feet. Call your doctor if you have any questions, or experience any of these or other troubling symptoms.

Your doctor may do special laboratory tests to check for nerve damage. If nerve damage is found, you and your doctor can decide whether the benefit that you might be receiving from thalidomide outweighs the risk of possible permanent damage to your nerves if you continue taking thalidomide.

Any side effect should be reported to your doctor. The following list contains additional side effects that may occur while you are taking thalidomide:

mood changes
dry mouth
increased appetite
puffiness of the face and limbs (edema)
dry skin
irregular menstrual period
low white blood cell count
thyroid problems
blood sugar that is too high or low
slow heart beat"

Yeah, Wonderful stuff!!!

I'd tell you more about Baycol et. al. but, it'd go right over your head.

kelpfoot - 2008-08-12

None of that has anything to do with animal testing, Pillager. And all of the symptoms you listed can also be caused by nut allergies.

But please, go on.

Pillager - 2008-08-13

Ok, I will.

Pray tell, what happens when a rat ingests atorvastatin or simvastatin?

kelpfoot - 2008-08-13

I don't know. Why don't you enlighten me, since you've proven yourself to be such an expert on pharmacology?

Pillager - 2008-08-14


http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?pid=S0103-64402006000400001&sc ript=sci_arttext&tlng=es


http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Cholesterol+and+cancer:+do+chole sterol-lowering+drugs+lead+to+tumors%3F-a018096162

Wanna see medical research that'll pay off?

Bet on Stem Cells.

http://www.canada.com/topics/news/national/topics/bodyandhealt h/story.html?id=e4e221a0-ffe5-44e7-9267-d8001d69c09e


http://www.marketresearch.com/product/display.asp?productid=14 76525&g=1

Animals are radically different. Medical results are to skewed to be useful to human needs.

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=2424 245

In simplest terms, what treats cancer in Rodents, doesn't pan out too well for Humans.

kelpfoot - 2008-08-14

"Influence of simvastatin on bone regeneration of tibial defects and blood cholesterol level in rats"?

"Suppression of breast cancer metastasis through the inhibition of VEGF-mediated tumor angiogenesis"?



Pillager - 2008-08-17

Let me try this again;

They've cured a mouse's breast cancer.

Sadly, the medicine that cures said rodent's cancer doesn't work in humans.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T1B -43DF5M5-W&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_ver sion=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=a064cccb8d66175d8c1b002cd37034 05

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